Could we get this thread….

Looking forward to post.

“Are we going to do “The Day After the Sun Was Gone” in a new thread?”…from preceeding post.

Regards
Ben

Now in film I DO use Science-Fiction & Fantasy as a genre I also use Animation, Classics, and Art House & International but in writing I would never use those genres. Disney’s Beauty and the Beast for example is clearly animation whereas Jean Cocteau’s La Belle et la Bête is pretty much the same story, albeit with a few variations here and there, but that’s clearly not Animation, so now the same story would be Science-Fiction & Fantasy, a Classic, or even Art House & International.

That’s fine for film but writer’s write the story so here I presume the similarity would be acknowledged with a “pure” genre, and it is, both are a romance, break it down… Two characters meet, they overcome various difficulties and in the end fall in love. You could argue these films are Fantasy but as I said with Sci-Fi the magic castle, living furniture, and even the curse placed upon the beast are all just props and locations.

The fact they don’t really exist in the real world is irrelevant as it’s fiction, most films, no matter how grounded in reality, take place in a fantasy world with fantasy characters. Look at the later Die Hards or Sylvester Stallone’s Daylight… They both blow up various real life New York landmarks that never really blow up. Should they now be classed as Fantasy too? or how about Hitchcock’s Rebecca, that burns down a fictional mansion, is that any different to Star Wars blowing up the Death Star?

Anyway, I must apologies to Philip for highjacking his great blog, so sorry, and 12-51-00 isn’t Sci-Fi at all, I just happened waiting for a train due to leave at 12:51 one day and as it pulled into the station my iPod decided to play a song called ‘12:51′ by my favourite band The Strokes and ever since I just had a thing for the numbers…

12 of 51-00,
With such a Sci-Fi handle, a number for a name, I am surprised that you are not a bigger fan of the Genre, yourself. I do think that we can say that Sci-Fi is a genre in that it uniquely does something that other genres do not. It always poses the question, “WHAT IF THIS WERE POSSIBLE?” That simple distinction makes it a beast in its own right, I think. But just out of curiosity, what are the different genres of literature that you would name as their own pure categories not just branches on the movie (literature) tree ? I kind of thought that each of the branches were genres.

Phil,
I love Robert Heinlein’s Rules for Writing.
My ex-brother-in-law is the author, Gary Paulsen. He has published at least 60 books in a variety of genres, from Sci-Fi to juvenile to How-To-Books. When he started out writing he had to rewrite over and over for his agent, who really forced him to learn his craft that way. To the point, now, where he literally just types, and it is done. He doesn’t even make typos, (he types with two fingers-hunt and peck–and he is very fast, much faster than I will probably ever be), and he never has to rewrite, now. In fact, he was doing that when he was still using a manual typewriter. That is probably why he learned not to makes mistakes. So, maybe that is just the high bar to aim for, especially with old school writers who only had manual typewriters to work with. And he even followed rule #3, because his rewrites were for his agent or at his agent’s request.

Are we going to do “The Day After the Sun Was Gone” in a new thread?

Looking foreward to it.
Aaron

Re: Sci-fi first page contest(kind of)

First page only and it only has to be one page of the screenplay/attempt or just the first page to get the producer’s attention.

So lets all post one page– lets call it “the day after sun was gone”

And remember it takes place 5 billion years in the future — that’s when the sun will die and loose all its energy and become a “burned out star”. No sun for the earth, what does that mean?

What would that future look like.

O.k. folks lets post that first page during the Holiday.

I will post my soon, just fine tuning it.

Regards
Ben

Re: Sci-fi writing…

Since the Holidays is here. And we have more time, this is what I am proposing as a way of sharpening our writing potential amd skills.

My 3rd script is a sci-fi and it takes place in year 2099(Alaska). It takes a lot of practice to write such a script in order not to make it “sappy” or boring and full of life. Eveyday is a “big fun headache” when I compose the action scenes.

Now the question — if a producer ask you or anyone in this blog to write a sci-fi script about life/adventure/culture on earth after the death of our sun (I believe the life-span of the sun is 5 billions years!!!).

What would be the first page of this screenplay look like? It has to be something we havn’t seen before in Hollywood and it has to be a page turner!!!!

I’ll post my soon.

Let’s see which one is the best by voting.

Philip, do you think this is a good idea?

Regards
Ben

Using the example of Donnie Darko, 30 days(?) in the past is a location to tell the story of a rebellious paranoid psychizophrenic, the time travel is just a mode of transportation, it’s no different to using a car, which is really just a prop which is something I neglected to mention before. Back to the Future uses Time Travel too but the too movies have few similarities over than that, so why class them in the same genre? It’s like saying The Devil Wears Prada and The Transporter are the same for having a Mercedes S-Class.

Then there’s Minority Report it’s very clever but those “precogs” are still just a prop, really, are they that different to how present day thrillers use DNA profiling or fingerprints? And again don’t forget that movie is about a framed man on the run, would it really be as good if they just spent 2 hours going around arresting people for murders they’re yet to commit? Also I know he didn’t commit the crime until later but that’s only one step away from the fractured story telling Memento uses.

I’m not saying Sci-Fi isn’t kind of a “genre” because there’s a very specific kind of people who like movies that use Sci-Fi elements but it’s not a genre just a “branch” of the movie “tree”… In that regard it’s like pornography…

Anyway back to my original point, writing a film just because you have a good Sci-Fi premise is a bad idea because no matter how impressive your fantasy world or explanation of time travel is it’s still just a prop or location and the examples mentioned so far are examples of good “sci-Fi movies” there must be 1,000’s of unproduced or unsuccessful “Sci-Fi” movies out there that prove my point ‘m just not a fan of the Sci-Fi so…

P.S. Yes movies like Blade Runner won’t work well in other locations but would Schindler’s List work on a modern day council estate in Barnsley? or a Die Hard in 1 AD Bethlehem with no skyscrapers.

And I am beginning to understand what you’re saying about setting. Of course, now I’m imagining a steam punk version of Blade Runner set in 16th Century Verona - that’s your fault. I’ll spend the rest of the daydreaming about how to make it work.

Damn you.

Maybe I’m not quite grasping what’s being said (in fact, I’m leaning in that direction). And I want to, please don’t think I don’t.

I don’t understand how “Science Fiction” is just a setting and not a genre.

I can see where the story of Star Wars could have easily be set in feudal Japan. Luke’s story could easily be one of becoming a samuri instead. But because the setting was space with future technology, it is science fiction.

Okay, for some stories, science fiction is a setting. Am I getting it?

It would be hard to do Bladerunner in 16th Verona without the concept of machine intelligence, for example. Or Minority Report without an means of foretelling the future.

Ben - storyboarding can be helpful I guess - I’ve never tried it, and I don’t actually know many writers who do - apart from one who was a (very good) director too. Anything that helps you think visually I guess.

MLewys - agree - loved the Prestige novel, not so keen on the movie- the really interesting question is, in general, to really think about why you are using the science part of the fiction if you can tell the story without it. Science fiction can, if it really isn’t intrinsic to the story, turn into just very superior window dressing (that can be stripped away as suggested by 12-51-00.)

What about The Prestige? That’s a science fiction because of the stage magical tricks - future science for the setting of the movie.

One of my favorite movies is Donnie Darko and it’s set in current day, right here on earth. It’s also a great mystery, but it has science fiction elements.

Science fiction deals with the influence of real or imagined science. Outbreak is science fiction even though it’s modern day dealing with a science that could potentially happen today. Simple because it hasn’t makes it science fiction and not a biography.

Science fiction isn’t just set in space or has monsters. Science fiction can be set now with everyday people.

Saying that however I’m still at the foothills of my first ever project so I will bow to your greater experience (for now). Anyway, as I make a living from reviewing movies I thought I’d share some thoughts on Sci-Fi…

Firstly, remember Sci-Fi isn’t a genre, it’s a location… Example: Say you wanted to adapt Romeo + Juliet for the big screen, you could place it in 16th century Verona, modern day New York, or in the year 2046 when the earth has becoming a toxic waste land and space pioneers have colonized Mars and formed too rival communities. Another good example is Star Wars, the first two are the best, but why? Because they’re not original stories they are an amalgamation of Kurosawa’s The Hidden Fortress and about half a dozen other great stories. Lucas then expanded the others using original ideas and the latter films just aren’t as good.

I heard lots of novelist eg. (Bourne Series), use storyboards first to visualize and then write.

Is this popular in screenwriting?

Maybe a screenplay heavy on action would require a screenwriter to actually physcially get into the action before writing.

Are these techniques popular??

Regards
Ben

M - ‘Shut up and write it!’ I like that. And it doesn’t like you are spinning your wheels too much in rewriting - that sounds about right to me.

My writing process (since I’m still unpaid) tends to call for rewrites. But at this moment, it’s only short stories (and one novella, but only one! I swear!). I write the story first - just whatever. Write it. Shut up and write it. I have signs on my wall that say that same thing.

Then, I reread it and clean it up. I fix my typos, awkward sentences, etc.

Then, it goes away for a while, usually to my husband. He reads it, which is helpful because he provides the ego boost while pointing out future typos, grammar mistakes, awkward sentences and overall story problems.

Then, it comes back to me for a final proofing where I fix anything that needs to be fixed.

I send out. I send out. I send out. After a while, I read again to fix anything.

I realize that I may not be able to afford this luxurious writing process when I’m being paid, but for now, I figure I can use all the help I can get at this point.

But thanks for keeping me looking down the road, Phil.

I read the script “alien” before, I like it but it’s not my “cup of tea”.

An as for the movie — speechless, good and bad.

What is your opinion of the UK production of JUDGE DREAD with Sylvester Stallone.
Is is a TURKEY or a CLASSIC?

And, any UK classic comic books out there?

Regards and take it easy this Christmas,
Ben

Imagine a world in which you had 20 screenplays out doing the round, all at 80% of your maximum possible quality. Much much better for attracting attention, I would suggest, than having just the one perfect script.

For one thing, your idea of perfect will never be any one else’s, so trying to achieve that on your own is subject to a very clear diminishing return.

For another, if you do practise exclusive submissions, which a lot of companies do prefer - all the time your one script is tied up with a production company - and it can be months before anything happens, even a rejection - your writing is invisible to the rest of the world.

On the other hand, I can’t believe that even Heinlein would send out first drafts. You have to make sure your script is pretty darn good before you show it to someone. It’s that 80% thing again.

But, basically, I’ve always read law three as a solid reminder to let my work GO and not get bogged down in endless (and probably pointless) restructurings just because I am nervous about rejection…

As far as SF descriptions go - well, it is just the same as any other description - short, to the point, no fancy stuff - it’s the idea, not the words, that count.

Examples? I always think the shooting script for Alien has absolutely terrific style, and is brutally concise. Notice how each line describges something. No fluff.

Have a look at:

http://www.dailyscript.com/scripts/alien_shooting.html

I don’t obey all 5 and I’m 95% sure that if I did, my writing career would improve tenfold.